[This text is machine generated and may contain errors.]

Transcript
Interviewee: Ronnie Barnes
Interviewer: Alston Cobourn
July 19, 2024, 1pm
Virtual interview

AC: (00:02)
That's Yes. Okay, I think we're started. Okay,

Hello. My name is Alston Coburn. I'm the university archivist at East Carolina University, and today is July 19, 2024. It is 1pm Eastern Time, and we are conducting this interview virtually via Microsoft Teams. So could you please start by telling us your full name, when and where you were born.

RB: (00:38)
I'm Ronnie Phillip Barnes, and I was born in Nash County, North Carolina. I was born on February 15, 1952.

AC: (00:53)
What did your family do for a living?

RB: (00:56)
My father was a minister, and my mother was a homemaker, and we were we lived in Wilson, North Carolina. My father also served in World War Two, and they adopted me at the age of one, and my mom spent her entire lifetime taking care of me. She did do some domestic work from time to time, but her big focus was on little Ronnie, and that was wonderful. I had two, two very loving parents, and they always wanted the best for me.

AC: (01:41)
What do- actually, I'll have, do you mind saying their names?

RB: (01:44)
Yes, my father was Willie Russell Barnes, and my mother was Lonnie Bell Barnes. Her maiden name was Cooper.

AC: (01:58)
What led you to enrolling as a student in East Carolina?

RB: (02:02)
Well, I went to [Wilson Pike] High School and and also [Charles Elcoon] junior high school, and at both those places, I was a student athletic trainer. I was not a great athlete, and I wanted to be involved in sports. And so one of the coaches said, "Well, you- you probably can't be- if you can't be an athlete, I think I weighed 98 pounds, then we- How would you like to be an athletic trainer?" And so this was really probably in 1967 or 68 and and so they sent me off to a sports program at NC State to learn how to be a student athletic trainer. And that meant that I was going to tape ankles, do first aid and assist the doctor in in taking care of injuries. So I've known since really, 1967 in junior high school that I wanted to be an athletic trainer. And East Carolina University had the very first sports medicine athletic training program in the state. I didn't know that at the time, [Carlester] Crumpler, who was a stellar football player at ECU I was his friend, his confidant and and his tutor, and he, I traveled around the country with him on recruiting trips. He went to, I remember distinctly going to Florida State University with them on a private plane, you know, a little propeller plane, all the way to Florida. And he decided that all the schools that of all the schools that recruited him, including Michigan State, that he wanted to go to, East Carolina. And and so I said, "well, I'm going to East Carolina. I want to be an athletic trainer. I need to speak to the folks in the athletics department." And the athletic director at that time was Clarence Stasovich, and he said, "Well, you're coming at East Carolina at the right time, because we we're going to start a sports medicine program," and that that was, that was great. Mike McGee was the coach, and he welcomed me and helped me and and that's how I wound up at East Carolina. I had to apply to other universities. Got accepted, but I knew what I wanted to be, and the fact that ECU had a program really enhanced that opportunity to go there and study.

AC: (04:50)
That's very cool that you you know, really knew what you wanted to do. Yes,

RB: (04:56)
very cool. It's very interesting because I went. To Charles [Elcoon] and to Wilson [Pike]. And I was in a select group of students that were selected to integrate the schools. That was called freedom, the freedom of choice program. And so about a dozen kids were assembled in a room at at the elementary school, and we were told that if we were interested, that we could go to Charles [Elcoon] the the Junior High School, the white Junior high school. At that time all white. And and so I asked my parents. I said, I'd really be interested in this. Can you show me the school? So I saw this school with big pillars, and I said, I I like that, you know, can you show me the high school? And they said, Sure, we'll show you the high school. They drove me around and and I like the high school. It's a big, sprawling campus. And I said, Now show me where the junior high school is, you know, on our side of town. And they showed me a three story building, and it was junior high. High school was Darden. Has it had a great reputation and had very good faculty, but I wanted something new and different, so I chose the Freedom of Choice Program.

AC: (06:22)
Okay, that's interesting.

I understand which makes sense extra now that you've told me, right, that that sports medicine program was just starting when you came here to ECU that you were the first African American student to graduate from that program. And so I was wondering if you could speak a little bit about that, you know, what were there any sort of specific challenges with that or, you know, generally, what was that experience like? What did, what does it mean to you, that experience?

RB: (07:01)
Certainly to be in a program to start up and and there were only three students in the in the first class, and that that was amazing, because we got one on one attention, both in the classroom and in the clinical experience, working with the teams. We were allowed, I was allowed to travel with football, I was allowed to travel with basketball, baseball, and get assigned sports. So I had a vast amount of experience prior to graduating. And the program grew, and it grew extensively over the years, but that one on one attention was amazing, and I felt like I was a sponge. I soaked up everything that Mr. Compton, the professor, had to tell us and and of course, in the classroom, it was something that was extraordinarily interested in. We got to work with the physicians, one on one, you know, the orthopedic surgeon, the primary care physician, the Ear, Nose and Throat folks, the ophthalmologist. They came in to speak to the class. But it was a real personal experience, you know, it was not a huge class. You know, it was probably equivalent to going to a private institution where there's a very small number of students. So that that worked in my favor. I fell in love with the profession. I was able to to get involved on the national level, even as a student, because the professor was editor of the Journal of athletic training, where peer reviewed articles were printed and published. And so I think I got, I received, an immersion in the profession, you know, at the age of 18 or 19 that students probably don't get today. Of course, they worked us many, many hours. You know, I think there probably rules, because there were, there weren't that many programs in the country, you know, accreditation boards and others didn't really look at the the amount of time spent, but I think I spent more time in the athletic training room, sports medicine room and on the football practice field than I did in the classroom for for my general undergraduate studies, but I spent a lot of late nights making up that time and studying. Yeah,

AC: (09:51)
it sounds like a very interesting experience. And actually, I guess I'll go backwards, but when you're talking about the freedom of choice program that you went to. So how did that how did that work out? What was that experience like?

RB: (10:06)
That was a great, great experience, obviously, to integrate the schools with something in that era that was uncertain, how that would go. Well, I was able to make a lot of friends, and I wanted to join every society that there was. The teachers were extremely helpful. I have friends to this day, lifelong friends. I think it was very fascinating because in Wilson, we had successful sports programs, and it was a small Tobacco Town, and everybody supported the sports teams. And, of course, I went on to [Pike] High School. We won three consecutive state high school championships, and the entire student body, you know, embraced that. I think some students struggled and dropped out and and I think what kept me there was the quality of academics and and the quality of the sports teams. And I don't know if you've been involved with athletics, but once you join a football team or involved with them, coaching or equipment manager and athletic trainer, that becomes your family, and or just as the teammates become teammates. And so I think that was something that kept me engaged, kept me interested, helped me to make friends, and helped me to to survive in in what was really different era, as you well know, right?

AC: (11:43)
Yeah, thank you for sharing that.

So when you were here at East Carolina as an undergrad, what groups, well, we've talked to you may not have been involved in many other groups or activities because you've already accounted for your time, but were there any other sort of groups or activities that you were involved in on campus?

RB: (12:06)
Well, you know, ECU was, was a great place to be. I didn't belong to any other groups or societies. I think my parents probably probably happy about that, because there are probably fees associated with it. So I was immersed in in the sports programs, and that took up most of my time. But you know, stayed, stayed abreast of what was happening on campus. Read the Fountainhead every morning or the student newspaper to determine what was really happening there. Got to meet many of the faculty. Oftentimes, folks from other departments came over to the sports department to get treated for something. So got to meet the provost. Knew Dr Leo Jenkins very well, because he was a big supporter of athletics. Got to treat him on a couple occasions for a store back or a sore knee. So and many of the benefactors you know, the Minges family, got to know them very well, the Williams family, the Belk family, all of those folks supported athletics. Got- I knew the dean. It is interesting though, I came to ECU on a football scholarship that was in a way to entice [Carlester] to come. They said, "We'll give your your tutor, your friend will give him a football scholarship," and, and, and actually, Mike McGee was the coach for one year, and then he went to Duke, and then Sonny Randall took over, and one day I get a call to the Randalls office saying I'd like to meet with you, Ronnie. So I went in, and he said, you're on a football scholarship. We really need all these scholarships, but we're going to help find you some money. Okay, so essentially, I went from being a scholarship to person to now looking for financial aid. And there was a financial aids officer named Mr. [Boudreau], and he put together a package. It was loans and scholarships, and I was able to continue my education. But, you know, there were deadlines for all of this, right? So I would always forget that there was a deadline. And probably a couple months- we didn't have email or anything, a couple months before it was time to go back, I'd say, you know, you missed all the deadlines, but I eventually learned to apply. But, essentially was able to continue my education through loans, and they've all been paid back. But you know what? It didn't upset me at all. I mean, I kind of bought into the to the athletics program. I didn't feel jilted by Sonny Randall. I I just said, I want to beat East Carolina. We got to find a way Interesting enough, though we were, we were, I would say we were poor, or at least lower middle class, but we didn't know it. But I did know that my parents probably didn't have the money to send me to school. So I found a way. And I'd say I'm not even sure that they knew all of these things that occurred.

AC: (15:45)
Right... well, yeah, I was wondering before if you had a part time job or anything.

RB: (15:50)
Yeah, they paid us some for working as student athletic trainers. So that was that was helpful. But no, I didn't work in the caf or on the library or anything else. No did not do that.

AC: (16:05)
Were there any particular events on campus that were memorable, memorable to you while you're here, like maybe a particular visit, or, I don't know, something of that nature.

RB: (16:19)
I remember a couple things. Howard Hale Brune came to speak. He was on the lecture circuit. That was something interesting that I went to see. I recall that in my freshman year, we played Marshall University, and I worked that game in the afternoon, and that evening, I became sick, went to and one of the football players took me to the infirmary, and the next morning, I had my appendix out, and I stayed for the rest of the two or three more weeks in the infirmary. They kept me hospitalized, but I would go to class and sleep in the infirmary probably about a week, but it seemed like three weeks and I missed... I was in the hospital for a couple days, and I went to the infirmary, but I missed all of the events related to that tragic moment when the Marshall team went down. Yeah, that was 1973 Yeah, right, yep. Very interesting time.

AC: (17:28)
Yeah, okay. Yeah. I mean, I imagine that probably impacted a lot of the people that you were close to, you know.

RB: (17:38)
That's correct as well some of the, some of the athletes that played high school or known, some of the athletes on the Marshall team, but I missed all the memorial services and everything else you know each year, when there's an anniversary, I think about that time you know.I knew the athletic trainer and and had met him and and all of them perished on that flight.

RB: (17:42)
Right, right. That was a very... yes, memorable event.

AC: (18:10)
Very unfortunate.

RB: (18:15)
We, we had lots of streaking on campus. I didn't streak, but that was interesting. We we lived- the athletes lived in, in Tyler Hall, big white structure on the hill. And and the athletes and and the the male student, students destroyed the building with with fire with fire hoses, or at least fire extinguishers, and all kinds of pranks. And the elevator was constantly not functioning. So I think, I think they moved the athletes out to Bell call at that time. And I don't know whether it's co educational or not, but it became a women's dormitory after the- after we stayed there for a year.

AC: (19:05)
Okay, so you stayed in the dorm with the athletes?

Unknown Speaker (19:08)
Yes, I did. Yes.

AC: (19:09)
Were you in the dorms all the whole four years?

RB: (19:13)
I was in the dorms the whole four years, and having no brothers and sisters, I loved it.

AC: (19:18)
Right? Right, right?

Unknown Speaker (19:22)
Someone to play with all the time.

AC: (19:28)
So what did you do when you left East Carolina? Tell us about where you went next.

RB: (19:34)
Okay, well, I graduated, and on the day that I graduated, I my parents came, we had a nice picnic, and the following Monday, I became an instructor in the Department of Health and Physical Education and the first assistant athletic trainer at ECU, okay? And that that was wonderful. You know? I've never applied for a job or had a job interview. I went from that job to another job to this job. So essentially, I did that. I recall that there weren't very many African American faculty members at that time. Dr Wright, who was a building is named for Leone- Leona Wright, or... the Wright Center.

AC: (20:27)
Ledonia Wright.

RB: (20:28)
Yeah, Ledonia Wright. She was on faculty. Dr [Chestnut] was in the psychology department, and there may have been three or four, two or three other faculty members, probably less than five. But I went to because I went to faculty meetings and, you know, get togethers, and that was very, very fascinating and and I enjoyed it. I taught introduction to sports medicine, athletic training. And I also taught first aid. I even taught in the old gymnasium [Christenbury], okay, but I taught summer school that summer, right as soon as I graduated, so I stayed at ECU and then I enrolled in the MSAS program. Didn't finish that. I finished a graduate degree at Michigan State, but I it was a master of science and administrative services, and it was our first attempt at an equivalent MPH program. So that, so I did that, and and, of course, I left ECU before I was able to finish it. But that's what, that's what I did. So I, when I graduated, I went to work at ECU as an assistant athletic trainer, as a an instructor in Health, Physical Education, Recreation and work with teams.

AC: (21:59)
How many years were you here in that in that role?

RB: (22:02)
I think I was there for three, three years, and then I had an opportunity. I was recruited by Michigan State to come and be their football athletic trainer and to have a instructor position there as well. So I told them no at first, and asked me, "So what are you making?" And I said, Well, I'm making $13,000 and they said, "Well, what if we doubled it?" And I said, "when would you like me to come?"

AC: (22:43)
Okay, so then you went there, and as you were saying, right? You did-ompleted a master's degree there. And what was your master's degree in?

RB: (22:53)
In exercise physiology sports.

AC: (22:57)
And then you worked there for a while, right?

RB: (23:00)
I worked there for four football seasons. And it's interesting because while I was at East Carolina and and partially while I was at Michigan State, I went to this I came to the New York Giants in the summers to assist them with their training camp. They started training about July 4, and I was certified as an athletic trainer, so I was able to come and work in in in New York to help the Giants, because there were over 125 players at that time, and they only had two athletic trainers, and the two athletic trainers were not college educated. They were. They learned the trade, you know. And so I came in and helped them out with injuries and help the doctors and and then I would go back to ECU or back to Michigan State, once the once our athletes returned for football. But July 4 was quite early, you know, to start football and and that that's, that's actually how I got involved with the Giants.

AC: (24:22)
Okay. And so then, will you tell us a little bit about how you made that transition from Michigan State to where you are now, and what you're doing now?

RB: (24:32)
Okay, well, I made that transition because I was asked to go to Arizona State by the football coach at Michigan State, you know, it's quite cold in Michigan, although I loved it. Michigan, it was a great place. And, you know, with over 70,000 students, it was a transition from East Carolina. I think we had about under 20,000 when I was yeah, and then to go to the school in the Big 10, with 70,000 students and a stadium that seated 75,000 to travel to places like Wisconsin and and to the University of Michigan, you know, the big house and all the schools that were in the Big 10 was pretty exciting. But this football coach Darryl Rogers, thought that I I would be a nice fit for him to come with him to Arizona State University. So I called the Giants owner, Wellington [Mara], and I said, I'm probably not going to come to the Giants this summer. I'm going to I'm going to go take this job at Arizona State in a couple months. And he said, Don't go there. Come here. That was in 1980 and so I came to 1980 that was in 1980 and I came to the Giants in that That's April of that year, and I've been here since, but I started working with them in 1976 so some, some years back.

RB: (26:11)
Four decades. Four decades plus.

AC: (26:18)
Have you? Have you... are there... I know you've been involved with East Carolina since you graduated and left here. Could you speak a little bit to how you've been involved with the university over these many years?

RB: (26:31)
Well, you know, ECU has a special place in my heart, primarily because of the great education that I received there, because it's near my home, and because I had so many fond memories, and you know, the faculty really, really cares there. I realized that, after going to Michigan State and seeing the size of that university and some of those students were receiving, or even that I received, ECU was home and and all of those special experiences, you know, getting to know Dr Jenkins, Leo Jenkins, who is an icon, legend in the state of North Carolina, and going through the struggles of watching him go through the struggles of trying to start a medical school, you know, we started with a with a single wide trailer, and we increased it to a double wide trailer right in the center of campus, near the science building. And they're just wonderful memories and and so I always was involved, both on the sports side and interested in what was going on. I mean, I could pretty much tell you who the Chancellors were from year to year, or the president the chancellor program. And so it's home. I They served it kind of in loco parentis. You know, when I was there, my parents used to say, you know, we are only an hour away. You never call. You're involved in sports. You know, we're here. Just pick up the phone and call us. But I had a new family and a new place, and that was pretty exciting.

AC: (28:17)
So I know that we have the Ronnie Barnes African American resource collection here in Joyner library. So that's one of the ways that I think of you being involved

since,

since you graduated from here. Do you want to say anything about that collection, and you know why you established that collection, or anything.

RB: (28:42)
Sure, it's interesting. Well, I'm always, I was always involved with the pirates club and buying tickets to help support the football program. And from time to time, I got to know the people from the foundation students would come to New York, you know, whether it be music students or some group and and I would either serve as an escort or provide some funds to help them in, you know, in their experience here in the city. And then there became an opportunity to sponsor a an African American collection. It just came up with with one of the foundation representatives, and I said I'd be interested in doing that. And that's really how it started. And knowing the deep history of North Carolina and the rich heritage of African Americans and how they helped to build that state, and some of the struggles that they went through, and some of the triumphs and and and and great opportunities that African Americans were provided in North Carolina that really weren't provided in other states. I thought this would be a great opportunity to capture that and tell that story. And so I think the athletics department thought, "why is he giving money to the library?" But when I spent time in the library, it was that I lived in a football dorm, so it was, there was a lot of noise there. You know, I think I even remember the librarian, Chief Librarian, and might have the name might have been Lanier, so I did spend time there. And so it was again, another home away from home, and great opportunity for me to to assist.

AC: (30:37)
Well, yes, we are very happy to have it here. Thank you. I know also you were right. You were the spring commencement speaker. And this past year 20 or this year 2024 you want, can you do you want to say anything about that experience?

RB: (30:53)
Well, you know, the chancellor Rogers had asked me in 2023 to come and give the commencement address. And I thought, "Boy, that's a that's a heavy lift, and I have something on my schedule. Let's think about it for 2024." And to my surprise, he called me and said, "Oh, we're definitely going to have you. We'd like to have you. What- would you say yes?" And so obviously home beckoned, and I responded. I thought that was and I'd been back to ECU many, many times to for various activities and awards. The Hall of Fame, sports, Hall of Fame Award, outstanding alum award received, and that. So I've been back, and this was a pinnacle, I mean, to to address, you know, 3500 plus graduates, although it required a lot of work and a lot of preparation, my father, being a minister, used to say that anyone can preach an Easter sermon, because you stand up in front of the pulpit and you say, "He is risen." Well, I thought this was an opportunity to talk to a class that had been through the struggles of covid, who'd missed their graduation, who may have missed their prom, and and, and being the helper and healer that I am, I understood that, and so I thought, I'll make the theme resilient, resilient and, And that was the theme, and it was quite easy, not as easy as "He is risen," but, but resilience was characterized that class, and I thought it was well received.

AC: (32:55)
That's great. Yeah, I believe you- you received an honorary degree at that time too, right?

RB: (33:01)
I did. I received an honorary doctorate letters. I thought, I didn't expect that, but that was very nice, absolutely.

AC: (33:11)
So you were mentioned a couple of achievements, but that I was going to ask you, you know, what achievements are you most proud of? And I know, right, as you said, it was 1990 is when you were inducted into the East Carolina Athletics Hall of Fame. And then the ECUs Outstanding Alumnus Award was 1998 and I believe you were also I know this is not a comprehensive list, which is why you get to tell me about what you'd like to tell me about, but you were inducted into the National Athletic Trainers Association Hall of Fame in 99 I believe, too.

RB: (33:45)
That's correct. And you know, there have been many, many honors that I have received along the way, and I give ECU the credit, mainly because that's where I got my start, that's where I got the fire and the enthusiasm to make this profession something special. And so yes, lots of awards if I if I had to look at an award that I've received or an honor that I most treasure, love and respect, other than my honorary doctorate from ECU that that's taking number one at the moment. But to be enshrined into the Giants, the New York Giants, Ring of Honor. Having spent four decades taking care of athletes and and working here with the ownership and the players to be there with some great athletes like Pat [Summerall]. And others, to just name one. [Phil] Simms a contemporary who was here when I was here at quarterback. I'm certain that Eli Manning will be in that ring. I'm thrilled that's that's one of the greatest honors that that I've recieved. My only regret is that my my parents couldn't be here for most of those awards. My mother saw me inducted into the ECU Sports Hall of Fame. We went to a banquet, and I spoke. I said a few words and and she said, "That was good. Why didn't you talk longer?" And then when they unveiled the portrait in the in the in the field house of wherever we were. Yeah, absolutely, she had to sit down, so I said, and she was feeling a little lightheaded, so that really was, I knew at that moment that she had a real sense of pride in my accomplishments.

AC: (36:13)
Yeah, that's nice.

I'm glad that she was able to come to that. Are there other things that you would like share? They might be. Sometimes people tell us things about, like civic organizations they've been involved in, or things about, well, like church life or their families, you know, other things like this, or really anything else that we have or have not talked about that you that you just want to share.

RB: (36:42)
Well, education has always been my focus, and students often ask me, "How can I be where you are?" about being lifelong learners, and I've invested quite a bit of time in in in education. This year, I was went to five different conferences and spoke at three of them. And that's, that's really been my life. You know, I spoke to the college athletic trainers this year in Las Vegas. Then I went to the NATA program in New Orleans, and there, you know, I've been all over the country spreading news. One of the things that I like to do is travel. And I've been 72 countries in the world. Actually, 73 countries in the world. And I think that that opened my mind about people in general. And, you know, I like the arts. I try to see all the Broadway shows that are here in New York. I'm going to see 'Water for Buffaloes' tomorrow- 'Water for Elephants' tomorrow. That's a show which is on Broadway. I've seen all the others. That I haven't seen, so I'll do that. So my focus been on education. I've worked a lot with the National Athletic Trainers Association, trying to I've worked in both the credentialing the NATA Board of Certification. I served for about 10 years writing questions and trying to raise the level of our profession. I serve on the American Board of family medicine as a public member, and we're working with the physicians who are diplomats in sports medicine that come from five different medical specialties, so most of my life has been about education, and I think I'd like to be known as as someone who believed that raising the level of education raises the overall character of people in general.

AC: (39:10)
What's your favorite country you've been to?

RB: (39:14)
Well, I

AC: (39:15)
mean, you might not just have one, but...

RB: (39:17)
Well, I'm an unabashed Francophile at the moment, but I've been to Asia and Africa and other places, but now I like to spend at least 10 days to two weeks every summer in Paris, which is my favorite city.

AC: (39:34)
Nice. Well, thank you for getting together with us... trying to think if there's anything else, right? Yeah, but yeah, thank
you for speaking with us and about your your experience with East Carolina and otherwise.

RB: (39:57)
Thank you. Thank you very much.

AC: (39:59)
Thank you.

RB: (40:00)
Have a lovely afternoon.

AC: (40:02)
You too. I will alright. Let me stop with this real quick.